How To Apply Creativity To Stand Out In Hospitality - Stefan Merriweather, The LINE

Josiah: Thanks for making some time to chat. I've been looking forward to this. I stayed at your LA hotel and then you opened this project here in San Francisco. And I thought, Hey, we got to sit down and talk about this because I love people who are building, creating interesting things. And you and I were just talking on the way up here, some gorgeous art coming up here, but maybe to set the stage, tell us a little bit about your role today and what it covers. And then we'll get into your backstory and then we'll get into some of these fun projects.

Stefan: Absolutely. So my role, I'm head of creative for the LINE Hotels, the NED in North America, as well as the Saguaro Hotel, which we have in Palm Springs. And really, you know, in my role, I sort of oversee the creative vision for the brand as it relates to sort of the tangible things on property to the experiences you have, and also through to our digital experiences as well. And we have a really great team as well, working to kind of make the magic happen. 

Josiah: I love it. I wonder if we could go back a little bit in your career, because that connection is really fascinating to me. The digital experience, my understanding, you've worked in digital, creative. I feel like you're very creative personally. People need to check out your Instagram. I'm going to link to it in the show notes. Thanks. But I'm curious if we could go back to how you got started in hospitality. Take us back there.

Stefan: What was your entree into the industry? I mean, it really started, it happened by accident. I was doing freelance creative direction. I was a photographer full time, just running around, trying to run my own photography business, which was very challenging as a very creative person, also trying to manage the business side. I really struggled with that. I just wanted to be creative, you know? And I actually got an opportunity to kind of work on a project that was part retail pop-up and part photography. And that's how I first got introduced to hospitality and hotels specifically through Soodal Group. So that's where I really got my start. I think that was about 2015. And you know, one of the first projects that I started working on was the Lion Hotel in Koreatown. And one thing I thought was very special about that property was this idea of how a hotel can be a champion for a neighborhood specifically. It was less about the broader city where it's at and more about this interesting sort of cultural microcosm that was happening in Koreatown. And I think it was like, probably 10-15 years ago, I don't think it was the cultural hub, it is not that the culture wasn't there. I think that people were a little hesitant to go to Koreatown, maybe they were concerned about crime or whatever it may be. And Hollywood was where everyone wanted to kind of be. So I think, you know, when I think about Sydell Group, and you know, Andrew Zobler and his sort of vision of thinking about it a little bit more opportunistically and how this hotel could really provide something different when it comes to sort of experiences as far as culture. And just to see, like, look back, what's interesting to think right now, is 2024, we're coming up on our 10-year anniversary of the line brand, which we're going to have a big celebration for that around next year in April. But I really, truly believe that that hotel has like helped change the sort of landscape of that neighborhood and in a good way. Because it's this idea of like, OK, as we grow, how is this community going to grow with us? And we still maintain that same philosophy today as you know, even with this hotel here in San Francisco.

Josiah: Is there something unique to hotels or hospitality businesses that can be a catalyst for change in a neighborhood as opposed to just general development?

Stefan: Yeah, I think one of the most important things is how you engage with the immediate community, how you're responding to the community, because I feel like we're we're only as strong as the community we're in. So we have to be part of the betterment. And I think here looking and we're sitting here in Tenderloin, you know, and it's like, look, it's there's a lot of improvement that needs to happen. I think that, you know, one of the first things that we looked at, it's like, Obviously, when you come into someone's neighborhood with literally like a physically imposing structure, it's like a huge responsibility what you're going to do with that opportunity. Right. So one of the first things we look at is the immediate community where we're hiring from, you know, and also sort of organizations that we can support as we come in. And, you know, with this particular project in San Francisco, there's some really great organizations that we've incorporated, you know, into the hotel. One is Hospitality House, which is like a really great organization that provides, you know, space for artists that are homeless or don't have space. And, you know, we do these like broad strokes, these broad strokes of actions. And sometimes we don't even realize how it impacts an individual. And so I was actually having a conversation with one of the directors at Hospitality House after we basically commissioned a piece of art and licensed it in the hotel of this particular artist, that it was the most money he's ever seen in his entire life. And it literally changed his entire life. And so to hear those type of stories and how, you know, we can impact like artists that are trying to get out creative expression and just don't have the means or don't have the space, you know, it's really something special. And I think it's important.

Josiah: I love it. This interview is going to be a little bit all over the place because I feel like there's so many threads I want to touch on. But and I just want to follow up on this because I've been having a couple of conversations recently with artists and they're just so curious. Like, what is the intersection between creating art and, you know, working with developers and that whole process? You mentioned commissioning art. You mentioned working with Hospitality House. I guess just in general, what's the typical process of developing a hotel? And at what point are you looking for artists to work with in that process?

Stefan: Yeah, I mean, like for me, that's the part that I get very excited about. So my first thing is like, what's the budget for art? And I think that's a special opportunity, right? Like when you look at this, let's call it this bag of money, right? And we're able to just inject that right back into the art community. That's like the general goal. So it's interesting you ask that because I have a lot of friends that are artists and people that kind of reach out and they're like, hey, I want to put this art in the hotel. When you have certain values and you have a certain vision, it's very easy to understand like what you're looking for and what works for the project. So being about the community and wanting to have a reflection of the artists in that community in the hotel, that's like the first criteria, right? And so then it kind of comes down to like understanding like the broader narrative that you're trying to tell and the artists that really fit into that. And for me, it's just a lot of research. It's a lot of research. It's a lot of being present. It's a lot of meeting people, hearing their stories, looking at their work, going in their studios to really understand. And like, one of the things that I also look for is the passion and you can't just like find someone online and be like, that looks great. I want to understand like what your story is, like how long you've been chipping away at this particular, you know, form of art, because it's all about, I love storytelling and design is storytelling.

Josiah: Can you tell me, I guess, tell our listeners the story of the piece you commissioned downstairs? I found it fascinating, I think, just to illustrate this process, because you're telling me a little bit about this piece. It's incredible. For those that are just listening to the audio of this, we were going, we were walking up from the reception. You passed this large installation of a lot of pieces. How many pieces does this?

Stefan: There is over 300 pieces that amassed the larger piece.

Josiah: So massive, massive. Tell me a little bit about how that project came to be.

Stefan: Yeah, I mean, prior to the line San Francisco, you know, all of our projects have been adapted, reused, you know, historical buildings, which it's very fun, right? Because with historical buildings, you get to sort of tell this narrative and these stories that are maybe connected to the history. So coming into a brand new building, it's kind of a blank slate. And I found this artist named, or actually I'll start over, we, I hate to like say I so much.

Josiah: We'll do another take.

Stefan: We found this artist, her name is Sassoon Kladpetsch. She's a Thai artist. She's been living and working in San Francisco for over 10 years. And just her work with concrete and resin and sculpture really resonated with us because the concrete aesthetic is really kind of a core element of the design of the line brand. So that was the first thing that sort of captured, you know, our attention. And she does these incredible sculptures that include organic elements, you know, bark, moss, and she mixed it with concrete, dirt, resin to create these incredible sculptures. And so, you know, we commissioned her to do this installation, and we really wanted some way to, you know, pay homage to what came before. And so we had her come to the site when it was under construction and actually collect pieces from the rubble, rebar, pieces of metal, dirt, you know, from the foundation. And she sort of included that into, you know, her sculptures, which adorn the walls now. And so it spans, you know, probably three or four walls long, and it's over 300 pieces. And just to watch her work meticulously through that as an artist. And it's kind of like I was saying before, like when I went in her studio, I was like, wow, the work that she's doing, the attention to detail is incredible. And she must have spent two months just like trying to figure out what the layout was going to be that was going up on the wall. So like that type of passion and energy to be able to have that reflected in the hotel was amazing for us.

Josiah: It was really impressive to me because walking in here, I think one of the unique parts of San Francisco, it has this strong connection to nature, which really makes it stand out from other cities across the country, around the world. And I think the mosses and some of these other elements that you mentioned made it. And then the elements of concrete and rebar and stuff like that, that became really interesting to think about, okay, how does this give me a sense of place, which everybody talks about? But I think my more kind of visceral interaction with that felt, it was really interesting. It hit me differently. So I think it speaks to the process that you mentioned of all the work of finding artists that match the vision, which, as you pointed out, is a lot of work. And I wonder if you could tell me a little bit more about that process. You mentioned visiting a lot of studios. What does that look like to immerse yourself in a creative community?

Stefan: Yeah, really, for me, it's a lot of, I love mood boarding. So it's a lot of, you know, research in finding and understanding like the visual aesthetics that kind of work together. So, a lot of it was, okay, we have all these different artists that could be potentially included here but how do they work together, you know? So, that is like the longest part of the process is having that sort of cohesion but still recognizing and celebrating like the differentiation of their works, you know? So, that's the biggest part of the process for me I think is like, Finding the right artist is one thing and their story, what they're creating and why they're creating it. And then the next step is like, okay, how does this all fit together as a story? And I think what's really special about hotel spaces as it relates to art is when you visit a city, you might be in town for a day, you might be in town for two days, you might not have an opportunity to go see, you know, every single museum or see, you know, works from different artists that are, you know, building and creating that city. And I feel like a hotel is a critical opportunity to be able to showcase that, you know, to people who are traveling.

Josiah: Yeah, it inspires people. And I think that is really fascinating to me about hotels because hotels give you this chance to step outside your day to day and experience something different. That could be culture. It could be furniture. It could be so many other aspects. But I think to that point of orchestrating all these pieces together, I wonder if you can sort of walk us through this process of, you know, opening a project like this. There's so many moving pieces. You kind of touched on a little aspects of this, but like wind back the clock on this project and kind of how does this come to be? And then how do you and your teams engage with this to create this beautiful hotel we're sitting in today?

Stefan: Yeah, I mean, it's a huge undertaking. I think, you know, one of a really important element is kind of like what the program is going to be, what the offerings are going to be. I think that one thing we really like to do is create branded food and beverage experiences. So that was like one of the first things for us. really was, OK, what are the food and beverage offerings that we're going to add? We're going to contribute to San Francisco. So we worked really hard to kind of figure out like what the right response would be and also get the right talent on board. You know, that's what it's really about. I feel like. without the people, it's nothing. And that was the moment where that hit me the hardest was like during the pandemic. I thought we were going to stop talking about the pandemic, but here we are. I remember walking into our hotel in L.A. and it was closed and just feeling it void of people. It was like nothing. It was like I can't even explain the feeling. But in that moment, I just you just realize that the sort of intersection of people from different walks of life Whether they're an employee working at the front desk, whether, you know, they're a freelance photographer editing photos in the lobby, like that sort of energy is what brings hotels to life. Everything else is just inanimate.

Josiah: How do you attract the right people to your teams? Because I imagine that's tough, especially maybe for folks that haven't traditionally considered a career in hospitality and you oversee a bunch of teams. How do you think about doing that?

Stefan: Well, I think it starts with having a, honestly, it really starts with having a clear understanding of what your mission, vision, and also your values are. I think we've kind of advanced past this sort of old mentality of on-brand, which we used to use as a reference point, right? Which I think now, I'm more thinking like, are we the right fit for you? Not are you the right fit for us? So, I think, yeah, the values are a very important part of that. So for us, it's creativity, collaboration, diversity, discovery. And, you know, if you align with those things and how we define it, then we're the place for you. You know, so that element is super important because, you know, I really we try to look at everything we do and make sure we're connecting back to that because the reality is we can do anything. We can throw any type of event we want. We could serve any type of food we want. But like, how do we know it's the right food? How do we know it's the right event? And that's where the values come in and are super important to help really define who we are and the direction we're going.

Josiah: Is there anything you do to become that right fit for them? As you said, sort of flipping the script on its head. But how have you thought about, I guess, I don't know what the word would be, if it's the culture, the kind of vibe on your team, or just how you operate? Is there something that you do that others maybe don't do in that regard?

Stefan: Look, I the first thing I think to understand is we just have to understand that we're not the right fit for everyone, you know, and you can't make everyone happy. And honestly, I think it goes back to this sort of like if you go back to like the Lion Hotel, Koreatown being introduced to people in 2014. Right. Like this is the a mythical kind of story. We always tell it. But when we first opened the hotel, This woman, she checked into the hotel, she was a business traveler, and she gets up to her room, she drops her bags, and she's like, what's going on? The walls aren't finished in my room, because it was exposed concrete. People hadn't seen that before. She thought it was an accident. And I think at that moment, you realize what we're doing isn't for everybody, and that's okay. But that's why it's also important that we're targeting and we're reaching the people that do get us. And it's not everyone, and that's fine. But with that being said, I think, you know, with our values and how we establish them, you know, we weren't in a vacuum. Like I wasn't in a room by myself saying, this is what it is. You know, our process was getting all the leaders together of our company and saying, let's start out. Like, what are the values that are important to all of us personally? Right. And like, what do you like to see from a company? And so starting the conversation there, and I think for us that that is really a reflection of why diversity is important to us, not only in, you know, race, socioeconomic background and all that, but ideas, right? People think differently. So if I'm sitting at a table with 10 people who think like me, that's not really benefiting anything, you know, but when you have people with different perspectives that are like pushing you to think differently, I think that's important. So I think that that element, you know, most people can get down with. Yeah.

Josiah: I love it. I was talking to Calvin Toloki a couple of days ago and he was talking about just the imperative of diversity and innovation. And he was saying like everything from technological innovation to how we operate to there's so much that is left on the table because many organizations have not made this an emphasis. And so it's cool if you kind of like walk around this place, you just experience what what the impact of that has been. And it's really cool to see. So in terms of that's really helpful to kind of think about the cultural element of this. And then what other I'm curious, like whether it's architects or interior designers, what are the other players in the mix when you're when you're launching a project like this?

Stefan: Well, the development team obviously is making things physically come together. You know, our finance team is I mean, there's some of the hardest working people out there, like honestly, you know, building out our budgets, making it all make sense, you know, revenue, you know, pricing our product in the market. I mean, there's so many different disciplines that are like critically important, you know, for a hotel to work properly and to be successful out to like brand marketing, creative, you know, our operators that are on the ground for food and beverage, I think is very important to us. But yeah, it's like, you know, all of those disciplines sort of coming together. And I also think, you know, it's super important for us to also, you know, exist to kind of challenge each other, you know, because I think that's how we get better. Like, I like to think of it like this, you know, because creative likes to spend a lot of money. So, you know, that's what we do. But I think that the goal is how can we get to a place where we're the most creative we can be and the most like operationally efficient. And that's why I think like it's important to really have strong people that understand their disciplines that are kind of running parallel to you, you know.

Josiah: What does that look like on a week-to-week basis? Because I imagine that's like a bit of a nirvana in some sense, or it's like an endless journey.

Stefan: A lot of calls, a lot of calls, a lot of meetings. Communication is key. That's what it is. And trying not to operate in silos. And for me too, I mean, like when you come from brand, You're kind of like the brand police too. So part of your job is saying no. It's like that ain't it. You know, that's part of your job. But I think one of the things that I've learned over the years is it's critically important to hear people out. It's critically important to hear people out, make people feel heard. And what I've learned from doing that is, look, a lot of people have really bad ideas. We know that. But then Some people have ideas that are bad, but they're just like one course correction away from being great. And then some people will surprise you and have a great idea. And you're like, did you say that? Like, wow, you know, so communication, staying open, listening is like critically important to successful collaboration.

Josiah: I want to talk a little bit about the business case for creativity, because I feel like you brought up a few times the kind of, you know, budgeting and how do you think about How do you think about budgeting? And I imagine there's a sort of opening the hotel element of that, but you mentioned going through budget season as well. And so I imagine there's a certain amount of, you know, operational budgeting that's always taking place. So I guess my question for you is what's the business case for creativity and investing in

Stefan: Man, I mean, like, I think that what is really special about brand and creative is this is where your true like DNA comes from. And it's how you differentiate in the market. And, you know, it's very competitive. But what I think is really great about the hotel market, I see it, it's like, It's like people with different personalities, right? And as a consumer, you have this ability to kind of choose. If you're thinking about it like friends, it's like you're hanging out with a different friend this week, you know? And so that's brand and that's creative. It's like defining like characteristics of how you're unique. and kind of like how you different, you know, it's the same thing. It's defining how you're unique, you know, and so that part's important. It ends up being a process of shooting for the stars and maybe landing in the clouds. A lot of times you don't always get what you want, but like I said, it goes back to that thing of the collaboration and getting to a point where operationally it makes the most sense and it's the most creative thing we do, we can do. That's really what we're trying to achieve.

Josiah: I'm fascinated by this. I also know nothing about this world. And so I'm curious, how do you even go about budgeting, let's say, on an annual basis for creativity? How do you think about that?

Stefan: Yeah, well, look, I think one thing is we have to pay artists, number one. I think that we have done a combination of things where maybe barter trades So it could be a photographer and wants to stay with us. And so we leverage, you know, providing them a hotel room for content. But what I really try to do is not push that conversation that way to that artist, unless that's what they're asking for. because I don't want to put us in a position where we're devaluing someone or to assume like I know what someone's value is. You know, so it is a process of sort of understanding what we want to achieve, the creative initiatives that we want to execute, and then backing out from that, seeing what the cost is. And then if we need to kind of like make some concessions after that, we do. But I think what's critically important in the process is really prioritization, right? So, you know, when we're establishing initiatives, we need to also know what is this on the priority level? You know, is it high importance, moderate or low importance? And so with that, we could be more flexible, you know, with budgets. And if, you know, our finance team is like, hey, like that ain't going to work, we're going to be like, OK, well, this number three thing that can go. So prioritization, I think, is like is very, very important. I like to come up with the big idea first. figure out what it's going to cost and then back down, you know, from there and kind of pick it apart if need be.

Josiah: Let's talk about the big idea for a little bit, because I'm just fascinated by this creative process. Yes. How do you personally stay inspired? You mentioned a lot of studio visits, a lot of conversations, but I'm just curious behind the scenes.

Stefan: Yeah, photography and travel. Those are my things I'll never forget. I was a very young father. I had my first son when I was 20. And so I really didn't get to travel that much. I was changing diapers when my friends were, you know, traveling to Europe and doing all that. And I remember the first, like, I think the first place I traveled to was Rome. That was like the very first place I went when I left the country. And it literally blew my entire mind apart. And it expanded my culture in so many different ways and the way that I looked at the world. So I think like, Travel is like, you know, number one. And when I travel, I really like to live like a local in that particular city, almost like a fly on the wall, sort of observing it and photography documentation. And what I found is I don't have the greatest memory. And photography really helps me remember a lot. But I was a photographer for many years. I still am, you know, today. And those two things really inspire me when it comes to Photography, I tend to have like a micro fascination with things. So I kind of zoom in on these pockets of time and place and capture those. And I like to capture them in a way where you're like, where is that? So it makes me look at the world in a different way. It makes me pay attention to the details. And I'm forever inspired by interior design, architecture, event experiences, and just like different cities and how people live differently.

Josiah: I'm curious how you think about this intersection between, I've heard hotels described as almost living rooms of their neighborhood or their community. And also, I guess like in a sense, a launch pad for going out and exploring. And you mentioned as just a personal traveler, you like to live like locals, which I imagine you're staying in hotels and kind of almost need that opportunity to get out there. But even walking around this property, I was really struck by how much it felt integrated, but also felt like an oasis. And so I don't know if any of this makes sense, but on a high level, how do you think as a designer leading creative, how the space should work and kind of serve those two needs, which feel diametrically opposed?

Stefan: Yeah, I think the way that I like to look at it, because I also like to look at it from an experiential standpoint, You know, at this point, I think we all know we have to be more than just like a hotel bed, right? And how I like to look at it is we need to be responsive to all facets of someone's lifestyle. So when they walk into the space, we're able to fulfill them and enrich them in like various ways. The bed's going to be comfortable, too, but in various other ways. So that's arts and culture, kind of what your experience and seeing hanging on the walls, but also you might be able to attend an artist talk that's happening that week, music and entertainment, usually a little low hung fruit for like most people, you throw a DJ in the space, but how can we challenge ourselves to kind of rethink and kind of reimagine how an experience related to music can be right. And then a big one is health and wellness as well. I think that's something that's obviously top of mind for people, especially post pandemic. And so when you think about like an amalgamation of like all of those elements together surrounding where you're sleeping, you know, it becomes like this sort of symbiotic environment that is, you know, connecting you in so many different important ways.

Josiah: Correct me if I'm wrong, but in my preparation for this, I heard that you also invite staff in to experience some of these amenities and programming.

Stefan: Is that right? Absolutely. Absolutely. Super important. And I think that we achieve a couple of different things when we do that. Number one, just internal culture is like super important. We want our employees to feel taken care of and good at work. So, you know, if we have a sound bath meditation to be able to invite, you know, employees to experience that and it helps with their health and wellness, just like it's helping with our guests health and wellness. Amazing. We want to provide that. But I think also what it does is it allows them to experience what guests are going to experience. So, if you can imagine a front desk agent that has taken a Tai Chi class, which we have in LA, and you have a guest checking in, Mr. Johnson, you got to try the Tai Chi class. They're actually speaking from experience. And I find it a better way for them to remember to communicate some of those experiences. And also, it's very authentic the way they're able to share like what it's like.

Josiah: Yeah, I love it. I love it. You're involved in a lot, Stephen. And I feel like in terms of I always kind of like to ask, you know, what are you most proud of or excited about? You know, right now it could be, you know, a big project. It could be an initiative. It could just be something you're thinking about.

Stefan: There's so many things that come to mind. We have so many great team members at all of our properties that are just creating and executing amazing things. I think I feel like I'm slighting people if I'm not mentioning what the thing is. OK, so one of the things I think is, you know, we did in L.A. recently, which I thought was really special. We did this project with this artist named Yeshua Kloss. And basically what we did is limited edition key card artwork that we engaged him to do. So we add him come to the hotel and stay as an artist in residency. And the sort of creative brief we gave him was like, think about this key card and think about what a key card means, which is access. And what does access mean to you? And he spun it into this whole thing about the access that all humans should have. And he did this art piece that the theme was food, shelter, water. And he believed that all humans should have equal access to these things. And so he created that a limited edition card, which I think we started releasing them on July 29th. And so I think there's a few left. So if you check into the hotel, you might get one. And also there's a charitable component connected to it as well, which is really great. So we have a video that's really great. That's on our Instagram channel that everyone can check out that really tells the story more in depth and detail. But it was one thing that I was very proud of that we achieved this year. And it also coincided with National Hunger Month. which is in September, so it's like, I love when we can hit so many different layers with like one initiative and it's something that actually means something because there's one thing to actually do something or say something, but there has to be like an action attached to it. So like the charitable organization component, I think was a super important part to kind of like top things off.

Josiah: I love that example because I feel like it even connects to so many threads that we discussed. And I feel like that's where creative collaborations are so interesting because it allows us to think about things that are maybe outside the day-to-day of what you're doing. And even just you kind of mentioning this concept of access, I was thinking back, it's been a thread almost through a few interviews that I've done where you kind of think it's a providing access is like an act of generosity. It's an act of hospitality. And it's a little bit out there, but I feel like it's really important to think of these things in art. Sometimes an artist, you know, provide an invitation to think about this.

Stefan: Right, right, exactly. And just the conceptual thinking. And it's very fun to sort of toss up a creative brief or a theme and just see how people respond to it. See how an artist responds to it because they might crack your whole world open, you know, related to something that they've been, you know, thinking about forever and you didn't even think about it. So, you know, generally with creative, I think that it's important to provide parameters. I think like the worst thing you can give to a creative person is just like an open field. But providing those little sort of guides and just letting them run and what comes back from it is is amazing, you know.